Ep 49: Art + Activism with Saul Williams
Click here for full transcript.
Art + Activism
Episode 49: Show Notes.
Welcome back to At the End of the Tunnel, a podcast that shines a light on the backstories of people who've taken a leap of faith away from convention and toward helping or inspiring people through their story, their work, or, in the case of today’s guest, their art.
Saul Williams is a multi-talented rapper, singer, songwriter, musician, poet, writer, and actor. He is known for his blend of poetry and alternative hip hop, and for his lead roles in films like the 1998 independent film, Slam.
Like this generation’s Harry Belafonte, Saul is first and foremost an activist whose medium is song. Themes that show up in his work include social justice, race, gender, and capitalism, and he has gone on to collaborate with the likes of Nine Inch Nails, NAS, Allen Ginsburg, and Rick Rubin.
Though he has been interviewed countless times during his prolific career, today’s conversation focuses on his backstory, diving deep into his upbringing as the son of a minister and an educator, both of whom were activists as well. Saul describes the moment that he discovered his passion for spoken word, which happened almost by accident, and how he had been preparing for that moment without even realizing it.
He also touches on his unlikely path to starring in Slam when he wasn’t the director’s first choice and explains why he decided to get into music later, a leap of faith that surprised even him. Tune in today to learn more about the incredible, inimitable Saul Williams!
Key Points From This Episode:
Saul reflects on his favorite activities as a child and why he says he was never bored.
Hear about Saul’s family heritage and his personal relationship with the church, activism, and the Civil Rights Movement.
How Broadway, gospel music, and Shakespeare influenced his decision to become an actor.
A moment in Saul’s life that influenced his view of the socialization process going forward.
The exposure he had to queer and trans communities growing up in New York.
How Saul envisioned his life playing out as a teen when he was enrolled in acting school.
How attending acting courses at Spelman helped Saul discover the intersection between Black art, expression, feminism, and progression.
How performing ‘Amethyst Rocks’ at Brooklyn Moon Cafe in 1995 officially opened the doors to his career as a poet.
The feeling that he was on the precipice of calling that night, reciting a poem he had written.
Why checking his ego as a poet was important; there was no room for braggadocio.
What Saul means when he says that he sees poetry as an algorithm, a coded language.
How practicing meditation helped him question the role of ego and remain centered.
Being on the cusp of the spoken word movement in New York and his responsibility to ensure that what he wrote was open and progressive.
Hear about Saul’s path to acting in Slam when he was originally meant to write for the film.
How he handled the notoriety post-Slam by focusing his attention on everything else he wanted to do as a musician, author, and activist.
The state of emergency at the time that encouraged Saul to keep asking “the big questions.”
The first time Saul met Rick Rubin and how he went on to record an album with him.
Saul shares his intentional decision to approach songwriting and poetry like a new generation of folk tales, or storytelling.
Shifting what we consider to be mainstream and delivering something that sustains a new generation of thinkers, activists, and human beings.
Why Saul says that he credits his kids with his success and the secret messages he has put in his work for them.
Looking back to his childhood and seeing how Saul’s imagination has come into play throughout his life.
Tweetables:
“The biggest toy I was playing with was my imagination. A sheet instantly became a cape. A stick instantly became a spear.” — @SaulWilliams [0:11:17]
“I read everything Shakespeare, partially because of the similarities and language between what was in the Shakespeare books and what was in the Bible. What Shakespeare would talk about and the jokes he would make versus the jokes that were not in the Bible.” — @SaulWilliams [0:25:40]
“Everything is going to have a clear beginning, middle, and ending. There has to be an art. You have to take us somewhere. You can't just come in.” — @SaulWilliams [0:35:43]
“The critical listening, that critical gaze was enhanced so much by studying acting at Spelman.” — @SaulWilliams [0:40:59]
“Here I was in this new role, reciting a poem that I had written, and I felt more empowered and felt I was touching people and myself in ways that made me excited to write more and to explore more of myself. I felt that I was on the precipice of calling that night.” — @SaulWilliams [0:50:00]
“Here was an unbuilt bridge that we were tasked with constructing, between our literary heroes and our hip-hop heroes.” — @SaulWilliams [0:51:48]
“We were and are using language in a way that abbreviates the experience for the sake of progressing it to the next chapter.” — @SaulWilliams [0:58:10]
“Slam, which was about the criminal justice system and the war on drugs, which is the same exact shit that we're focused on right now, it felt crucial to spark that flame and to keep on attacking those big questions through the work.” — @SaulWilliams [1:18:32]
“I did decide early on, around the time of the earliest poems, that I wanted to tell a new generation of folk tales, a new generation of storytelling.” — @SaulWilliams [1:29:34]
“The industry just needs to regurgitate and recycle in order to feed itself. We are hoping to deliver something that actually feeds, that actually sustains a new generation of thinkers and activists and human beings.” — @SaulWilliams [1:36:30]
“My work has always been seasoned and peppered with the sensibility that comes from the fact that I know younger ears are listening.” — @SaulWilliams [1:39:50]
Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode: